Gov. Gary Johnson battled it out over drug legalization with the new administrator for the DEA during a heated debate at the UNM Continuing Education Center Monday.
The public debate was the first on drug policy for Asa Hutchinson, who was confirmed to the Drug Enforcement Agency post by the Senate Aug. 8. About 250 people packed the auditorium for the event, which was taped for the Pennsylvania-based weekly National Public Radio program “Justice Talking.”
Margot Adler, the host of the program, introduced Johnson and Hutchinson. She said public discussion of drug policy and law enforcement was of growing importance.
“Since the Nixon administration, Americans have spent billions on drugs, and billions fighting them,” she said.
During introductory speeches, Johnson said he was fighting for the legalization of marijuana and the lessening of punishment for other drugs, increased drug prevention education, and what he called “harm reduction” — providing such stopgaps as methadone and needle exchanges to users to prevent overdoses and the spread of disease.
Johnson has gained nationwide attention for his belief that the “war on drugs” is a failure.
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“Half of law enforcement, half the courts and half the jail population are drug related,” he said. “90 percent of the arrests are for possession only, and half these are Hispanic. I’m going to live to see 80 million Americans arrested for drug use. We have to stop arresting 1.6 million people a year.”
Johnson called drugs a handicap and said he didn’t think anyone should use them, but said the decision should be left to individuals, not law enforcement.
Hutchinson agreed with Johnson’s statement that drugs are harmful, but said legalization would only encourage use.
“If we as a nation want to discourage use that harms, our laws should reflect those values,” he said. “Our laws should be the master teacher, and they should be enforced.”
He said he supported the idea of public debate on the subject, and that he was a strong advocate of programs like drug court, which allows some offenders to go through treatment programs and community service in lieu of jail time.
Johnson said his views on drug policy came from personal experience — he has publicly admitted to using marijuana in the past.
“My fundamental belief is that these are bad choices, but you’re not harming anyone but yourself,” he said.
Hutchinson, a former U.S. representative from Arkansas, said his experience as a federal prosecutor allowed him to see what drug use did to families.
“We can do better than giving in to drug culture,” he said.
Adler asked the two to outline their ideas for what the U.S. drug policy should look like.
Johnson said his ideal policy would work to reduce death, disease and crime through treatment, and stress legal action for drug users who harm someone else while under the influence of drugs. He called attempts to seize drugs at U.S. borders, “pissing in the wind,” and said more money should be put into education and treatment.
Hutchinson agreed that an updated policy should include strong treatment programs. He called education a critical component, citing its role in recent shifts in public opinion regarding tobacco and seatbelt use. But incarceration, especially for traffickers, should continue to be available as an option, he said.
Johnson contended that incarceration was overused.
“The government assumes that everybody that smokes marijuana belongs in jail,” he said.
Hutchinson argued that fining people for minor drug offenses would fail to deter users.
“I don’t think you’re discouraging use by saying you’re not violating a federal law,” he said.
Johnson defended Hutchinson after the crowd booed the DEA administrator’s suggestion that New Mexicans are not buying in to the governor’s ideas.
“This represents a huge change in federal policy to have Asa here to talk,” he said, congratulating Hutchinson for his participation.
Michael Chapman, the chief public affairs officer for the DEA, traveled to the debate from Washington, D.C. with several agents to support Hutchinson.
“Mr. Hutchinson is genuinely interested in doing the best he can do to answer the problem of drug abuse, and he’s more than willing to get the message out to the public, and listen to what they have to say,” he said.
The debate was sponsored by the UNM Law School, KUNM 89.9-FM and the National AIDS Brigade.
